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Doing things the old way
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Author:  Jimmy Caldwell [ Thu Dec 14, 2006 3:15 pm ]
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I've long been interested in vintage instruments and decided not long ago to invest some time and effort into researching guitars built in the 20's and 30's. I've had an opportunity to play quite a few old Martins from that era and every one of them had one thing in common. They are all light as a feather.

I've switched gears and am starting some vintage style instruments, doing things "the old way". Dovetail necks, 1920's style bracing, thinner plates and rims, all based on plans from actual vintage instruments. It's quite a change from my normal guitars, but it's a lot of fun.

Here's a couple of progress pics. Brazilian/Adi 12-fret 00 body style with 42 trim. Woodworking should be finished in a few weeks. Thanks for looking.



Author:  Kevin Gallagher [ Thu Dec 14, 2006 3:29 pm ]
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Jimmy,
   That is awesome!! I love those vintage featherweight guitars. I've owned a
bunch of Martins from that era and have repaired and restored a dozens of
them. Each time one would come through my door, I would measure and
document alot of the dimensions in them with the sole intention of using
them one day to do just what you're doing.....building guitars that are truly
in that style.

    Beautiful work and gorgeous woods. I love that 42 style Abalone purfling,
too.

Thanks for posting it,
Kevin Gallagher/Omega Guitars
Author:  mhammond [ Thu Dec 14, 2006 3:55 pm ]
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Jimmy: I have also started a guitar in the 20's style. I'm looking for just the right mahogany to pull it off and it will be quite a bit plainer than your beauty. My question is about the "20's style bracing" would you please elaborate?
Author:  charliewood [ Thu Dec 14, 2006 4:57 pm ]
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Yes Im echoing the sentiments above
please elaborate on this build in any way possible - its truly gorgeous! If you have photos of the build we'd love to see the guts and such
Cheers
charliewood
Author:  peterm [ Thu Dec 14, 2006 6:16 pm ]
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Very impressive work!! Absolutely gorgeous!
Author:  PaulB [ Thu Dec 14, 2006 9:39 pm ]
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That looks great Jimmy, I've been a fan of your stuff for a while now.

Can somebody define "as light as a feather"?

I built my last guitar (jumbo parlor) as light as I could, I can pinch the top of the headstock between thumb and fore finger and hold the guitar horizontal without much effort. Is that in the ball park of what you're talking about? I've only ever seen pix of those old Martins on the net.

It's probably becoming apparent why I'm so interested in Ervin's stuff.PaulB39066.2399884259
Author:  TonyKarol [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 12:08 am ]
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Hi Jimmy .. so what kind of jig - or how - did you do the ab purf around the FB end ??? I have been contemplating doing one of these, but havent figured out exactly how to make this somewhat foolproof.

thanks ...
Author:  TonyKarol [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 12:09 am ]
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Oh .. please excuse my ignorance .. that is one SWEET looking guitar - i am sure it will sound amazing.
Author:  LanceK [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 12:29 am ]
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Super!!!
Author:  af_one [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 12:45 am ]
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I think you've struck a trend nerve here? Seems like many of us want to do what you are doing. Would it be possible to get measurements or plans to buy or start a thread--I hope I have not infringed on a proprietary issue.
Author:  JJ Donohue [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 12:46 am ]
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Jimmy...that style happens to be one of my favorites and you have pulled it off beautifully.

Along with others I'd be most interested in knowing the specs and parameters of your design.

This is a noble endeavor you've started and thanks for posting.
Author:  letseatpaste [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 1:36 am ]
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I'm almost always impressed when people post pictures of their work here, but I gotta say: I am such a sucker for a retro-ish parlor guitar. Ones like this and the Kay copy that John How posted, and some others whose name I can't remember right now... The classic style and the level of workmanship inspire me, thanks for posting. I've got a couple parlor sets of Brazilian waiting for my skill level to warrant their use.
Author:  C Kent [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 2:08 am ]
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Super!
Author:  Dave Anderson [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 2:31 am ]
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GREAT JOB Jimmy!
I'm a big fan of these guitars also!
A guitar like this is in my future plans so any more info(such as bracing) would be appreciated.TIA
Author:  Don Williams [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 2:52 am ]
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Very nice Jimmy!

I think if you were to poll the OLF on who is a fan of old vintage Martins, you would find a surprising number of fans.
I carry my "Martin Guitars" book around with my everywhere I go. It's like an obsession for me reading about the greatest production guitars in history. I'm going to be building some myself - not to sell, but for my personal instruments. Specifically, I'm planning on a OO, a 12 fret OOO, and an OM.
I'll spare you guys yet another shot of the BRW I have planned for those.

One caveat...if anyone is thinking about building & selling traditional styled guitars, you'd better deal with learning to set a dovetail, and you'd better get your building chops up to snuff. With guys like Julius Borges and TJ Thompson out there, the bar has been set WAY high...
Author:  Jimmy Caldwell [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 3:32 am ]
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Thanks for all the kind words. For anyone interested in building vintage instruments, I'd recommend doing a lot of research. There is a ton of information available on the net, but the best information is found in the guitars themselves. Find as many as you can and get out your inspection mirror. Play them, feel them, and look inside. You'll likely come away saying "I can't believe that thing hasn't exploded by now". One of the best things you can do is find a mentor. Someone who has experience with vintage guitars and really knows what it is about them that differentiates them from contemporary instruments. You have to rethink the way you do things and it's very comforting to have an experienced voice coaching you. It's far more than a body shape or some abalone trim and the true connoisseurs will know the difference. Things were done differently back then and as the guitar has evolved over the years, we've lost some of the magic of these old instruments for a variety of reasons. Don is right about the height of the bar. There are some incredibly talented builders out there doing this type of work, and their instruments are in great demand.

For those who asked for pictures, I'll try to get some posted in the next few days. And Tony, the jig I made for abalone around the FB extension is super simple. I'll get a pic of it up also. I've seen your work and this will be no problem for you.Jimmy Caldwell39066.4818981482
Author:  Alain Desforges [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 3:47 am ]
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Fantastic Jimmy!

Wow, that really is something else. That BRW is very delicious looking.

Is there a definitive book out there or some really good plans with those old specs and dimensions? I have no access what so ever to vintage Martins.
Author:  Don Williams [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 4:41 am ]
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[QUOTE=Alain Desforges]Is there a definitive book out there or some really good plans with those old specs and dimensions? I have no access what so ever to vintage Martins. [/QUOTE]

The Martin website has some basic dimensions. You will have to rely on plans sold by GAL or others who have measured vintage instruments. John Hall is a good source for a lot of that.

Don't expect to be able to walk into a vintage builder's shop and be able to get plans and templates etc. Those guys have busted their butts to get to where they are, and won't just hand over trade secrets to you. And why should they? They understand the importance of the learning process. They didn't have the luxury of shortcutting that process and feel that others who want to go that direction should also cut their teeth like they did. Seems pretty reasonable to me.
Most builders with good building chops can build a guitar that looks like an old Martin. Making it play and sound that way is another thing entirely.
Author:  MSpencer [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 5:06 am ]
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Very Nice! I too have started working with much thinnner and lighter Tops, B&S and bracing on the 1930's style Gibson J-35 and really have enjoyed the change. I moved away from scalloped bracing and my brace tucking methods approaches are different compared to past projects. Great looking instrument and would love to hear a sound clip once it is complete.

Thanks for sharing

Mike
Author:  Steve Kinnaird [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 5:50 am ]
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Jimmy, that really is beautiful.
You've posted (and are building) my favorite Martin shape. I've got a 12 fret 00 Martin from their custom shop (modern guitar), and have one question for you:
how many frets do the ancient ones employ?
My guitar uses the full 20 frets, plus adds some length to the end of the f/b, pushing the soundhole back further (in my opinion) than it needs to be.

Would love to know what your research shows, and what you yourself are doing w/ that one point.

Again, what a beautiful guitar! Well done.

Steve
Author:  Jimmy Caldwell [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 6:02 am ]
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Steve,

19 frets is correct (I must have been having an AARP moment). I'm trying to remember the dimension from the center of the soundhole to the edge of the top and I think it's 6.5". The soundholes are 3.75". I'll double check that tonight and let you know.Jimmy Caldwell39067.4068402778
Author:  Arnt Rian [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 6:46 am ]
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Jimmy, I'm just piling on here, but that is a terrific effort! I also agree with Steve K, the 00 12 fret is my all time favorite Martin shape. I have a '46 14 fret 0018, and I've inspected a few "golden era" Martins, but living in this part of the world they are of course extremely rare. I'll be interested in any data you have to share about the instruments you have studied.
Author:  jfrench [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 10:18 am ]
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Jimmy... Excellent work! Please do let us know how you like it when its strung up. The aesthetics are perfect, and I'm right there with you enjoying doing things the old way.

I bet that will be an extremely fine instrument!
Author:  Don Williams [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 10:22 am ]
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Jimmy, is this short or long scale?
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